Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

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Jim_Mercer
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by Jim_Mercer »

Phil_SK wrote:Not all the corrections are accessible - 2000 isn't, annoyingly! - but these don't mention that one:
2001: https://web.archive.org/web/20010717152 ... tions.html
2002: https://web.archive.org/web/20030218081 ... tions.html
2003: https://web.archive.org/web/20031006003 ... ndex4.html
Corrections for 2000 seem to be on my CD but nothing for 99-41 (and I have searched the complete 50 yearlisting)
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by Jim_Mercer »

My very neglected plant - I know it needs more water, more light and a spray of something for all the bugs/spiders
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by BrianMc »

Definitely not Crassula sarcocaulis!

Could be a Tylecodon, or looking at the new stem growth I'm reminded of Othonna
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by MikeT »

BrianMc wrote:Could be a Tylecodon, or looking at the new stem growth I'm reminded of Othonna
Assuming the plant is from the ISI stated locality, Othonna is plausible. Without flowers, I don't think ID at even genus level is going to be practical. Could be a long wait...
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by Hedge »

I have grown the garden variety of C sarcocaulis and it had brown woody stems which were definitely not succulent, and pink flowers. It didn't look like your photograph.
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by Liz M »

I have been following the discussion here with interest. I would suggest that the original plant was wrongly labelled, as I have these pictures of two plants of mine. The first two are of a Sedum frutescens, which I got from Alan Hart a couple of years ago and he must had had it for many years as it is at least four foot high. The third is one given to me and labelled Crassula sarcocaulis but I have never been convinced, as I have Crassula sarcocaulis and the leaves are small and nothing like this. Also, it is to me identical to the Sedum frutescens from Alan Hart. Here are some pictures taken last night.
Sedum frutescens from Alan Hart
Sedum frutescens from Alan Hart
Another view of Sedum frutescens
Another view of Sedum frutescens
Plant labelled Crassula sarcocaulis
Plant labelled Crassula sarcocaulis
The third pictures show a plant with long thin leaves and a groove down the middle, that indicates to me, that it must be Sedum frutescens. Whether any of these bear any resemblance to the original picture, I leave in the hands of Mike T
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by Jim_Mercer »

The location given on my label and the original description with the ISI distribution does appear to have a slight spelling mistake as I think Mpumulanga should be Mpumalanga which is listed as a location for Crassula sarcocaulis here http://pza.sanbi.org/crassula-sarcocaulis

I don't think my plant is a Crassula but looking at images on google using Mpumalanga as part of the search did find a picture on this page http://www.crassulaceae.ch/de/artikel?a ... S&aID=2099 that shows leaves similar to Mike's plant but the leaves do seem to be in pairs
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by MikeT »

Liz M wrote:a plant with long thin leaves and a groove down the middle, that indicates to me, that it must be Sedum frutescens.
Some of the leaves on my plant have a median groove, but by no means all - the picture gives an accurate idea of this.
IMG_2930.JPG
Ray Stephenson's Sedum book seems to indicate that all the leaves in Sedum frutescens have a groove.
Do all the leaves on your frutescens have an obvious groove, Liz? The bark and general appearance certainly look very similar.
If this is Sedum frutescens (looking more likely now), there's been a real mix-up somewhere along the line in the ID, it clearly wasn't collected anywhere in South Africa.

The Sedum Society Newsletter in 2007/2008 included a list of Crassulacean ISI introductions up to 2005, after which plants weren't distributed in Europe; checking this, there were no Sedums in 1999, and Sedum frutescens was offered once, in 1968, as ISI 552. Difficult to make this into ISI 99-41 by accident.

I'll send Ray some pictures and ask for his opinion on frutescens
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by Liz M »

Hi Mike, I have to say that not all the leaves have a central groove, just most of them. The older, outer leaves seem to lose it, presumably they drop off first. The newest ones don't have a groove, either, mine have it when they are full sized and when they are in full growth.
Looking at yours, I would say it is the same as mine and I have no doubts that the large old one and the one originally called Crassula sarcocaulis are identica, they certainly look itl. I would suggest that yours has been grown in a greenhouse, as it is paler than mine, which has been outside for some weeks and has had good light and has been subjected to the weather. Other than that, if it were mine I would call it Sedum frutescens, unless someone can come up with a new plant.
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Re: Crassula sarcocaulis - or not

Post by topsy »

Hi Liz & Mike,

This plant is most definitely not Crassula sarcocaullis, it has to be Sedum frutescens.

Questions: Has it flowered and if so what are they like, what colour are they?

Is the plant quite brittle, do small bits break off very easily?

C.sarcocaulis does not have papery, peeling bark,does not attain the same size as S.frutescens and is semi-hardy, here in the U.K.

Whilst I am happy to leave my Sedum outside for the summer it has to come in before a frost occurs, the same is not true of the Crassula. C.sarcocaulis when it flowers, smells like rotten socks, or what I imagine they smell like, the Sedum does not.

I hope that this helps.

Suzanne Mace
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