Plant imports & CITES & permits

[McFarland]

As my current understanding is according to http://www.cactus-art.biz/note-book/Dic ... _cites.htm

appendix 1 species basically no international trade is really allowed,

appendix 2 which includes most euphorbias (except App1 species) which is what I am interested in, this would mean I would need a phyto certificate, and a CITES-nursery certificate. Nurseries that grow alot of euphorbia seem to be in Thailand.

would I also need to get an import certificate from DEFRA or whoever liscences this kind of thing?

hope someone can improve my understanding, and if you know any international sellers in south africa or thailand feel free to mention (the US sellers seem very lazy about exporting! )

[iann]

Phytosanitary certificates are completely separate from CITES. You should assume you need one of these for any plant import (except seeds) from outside a European area which is not quite the same as the EU. This isn't usually cost-effective for small numbers of plants but it depends on the country. Some countries just seem to issue them for the fun of it, or perhaps some sellers just print their own Plants may be stopped for inspection, which means DEFRA store them in a warehouse until they can be bothered noticing that they've died , but usually they will come through with the right paperwork. Or they will come through without out unless some drug sniffer dog is attracted to your Euphorbias.

CITES I, pretty much forget doing it legally. Theoretically there are some exceptions but in practice you aren't going to satisfy them. Seeds of CITES I species are basically treated as CITES II listed.

CITES II, you'll need a permit from the sender for any import of listed plants from outside the EU. EU listed plants are slightly different from the actual CITES II list but that probably doesn't affect any of the plants you're interested in.

Mesa Garden can do the paperwork for both CITES and phytosanitary certificates, but many sellers don't.

[lobman]

It really does make sense to club together for plant orders , just to save money on the paperwork , and postal charges , otherwise you can end up paying more than the cost of the plants

[McFarland]

just to clarify, say for example I got plants from Thailand, the nursery there just needs to sort a phyto and CITES certificates, I don't need any kind of paperwork from UK defra or customs or whatever?

The nursery I'm looking at sorts CITES certificates for as low as 7 or 8 dollars, and phyto for around 5 dollars, I guess because they are big they benefit from economies of scale

[pieter]

Hi,
Apart from CITES and a phyto, you might want to declare the parcel prior to arrival with the invoice. Even if you have the CITES and phyto, they could retein the packet till they have the invoive and till you paid taxes on the invoice amount (including postage).

[McFarland]

Ah thanks for that pieter,

I think I found the relevant bit on the customs website. Apparantly there is 14,000 different tax codes for import/export...good god!

Well to go through that hassle it would have to be an amazing huge box of incredible Euphorbia which I doubt i'll find so I dare say I won't go through all the hassle, but useful information to know anyway

[AnTTun]

The nursery I'm looking at sorts CITES certificates for as low as 7 or 8 dollars, and phyto for around 5 dollars

Or they print them by themselves 24/7 Just kidding, tho it happens as well. Most likely Thai authorities (as usual) act fast to help their economy. And agriculture. And succulentculture.

Anyway, if permits are so low, what are the plant prices?

[McFarland]

From what I have seen plant prices are reasonable in some other countries, it just comes down to all of the paperwork and postage which probably pushes the price out of reach of most if not all collectors

I was interested in plants like this:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/130628228955? ... 499wt_1416 (reasonable price)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Euphorbia-Eck ... 302wt_1395 (not so reasonable? then again it's fairly rare one)

[Lithos]

Hi Sachi - I've had a few bits over the years from three or four nurseries in Thailand. The plants are always immaculate, very clean and usually have the roots dipped in some insecticide, the details of which are always included on the very thorough and multiple copies! of the phytosanitary certificates I've always recieved - never had to pay extra for them though. The parcels are a work of art, and usually get here quicker than stuff from Europe. They tend to pay more attention to insulating the plant a little better than are European friends, who seem to think a bit of old bog roll, is ideal at this time of year!

As for the Euph. ecklonii , it's probably not expensive for that plant, but I wouldn't want to be flying it half way round the world (again) in a cold hold and trying to establish it in our winter. It is extremely difficult to keep alive in the best of circumstances. A lot of pictures you see of this tend to be of plants that are growing/looking fine purely off the reserves in the tuber after being collected, very few folks succeed in actually getting it to grow year on year. But hey it's fun trying these things if you can afford it! I'd wait until spring /summer, Ernst at Exotica almost certainly have them, as may, your eastern european buddies.

[AnTTun]

Baaad shipping on first one, goooood on second