Lithops nameing

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Ivan
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Lithops nameing

Post by Ivan »

I have come across this a few times. There is an ex- in front of some Cole Lithops numbers.
For example Lithops gracilidelineata v. waldroniae ex-C189. Can anyone tell me what that means or is?
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iann
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by iann »

The plant or seed is descended an unknown number of generations from that Cole collection number.
Cheshire, UK
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Ivan
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by Ivan »

Thanks, Ian. Very simple and maybe should be done more often?
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cactuspip
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by cactuspip »

The short answer is yes.
There is a tendency to use collection numbers for plants grown from seed not collected in habit.
As the process of producing seed from succeeding generations continues there will be degradation, in terms of reference to original collection.
There is also a very real probability of selective crossing taking place.
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Ivan
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by Ivan »

Here is another naming query. I am using this just an example. Is it possible that Lithops schwantesii var. marthae be both C411 and C249? The differnce I found is one is Lithops schwantesii v. marthae and the other Lithops schwantesii ssp. schwantesii v. marthae. Am I missing something? :???:
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iann
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by iann »

Ivan wrote:Here is another naming query. I am using this just an example. Is it possible that Lithops schwantesii var. marthae be both C411 and C249? The differnce I found is one is Lithops schwantesii v. marthae and the other Lithops schwantesii ssp. schwantesii v. marthae. Am I missing something? :???:
Lithops schwantesii ssp. schwantesii v. marthae is the same as Lithops schwantesii v. marthae. Intermediate taxonomic levels with the same name as the parent are implied and usually not written out. That variety is found at four Cole locations. Not sure how different they all are, I don't have a single var marthae, not my favourite species.
Cheshire, UK
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Ivan
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by Ivan »

iann wrote:Lithops schwantesii ssp. schwantesii v. marthae is the same as Lithops schwantesii v. marthae...
So, what I understand from that is marthae has both C249 and C411 Cole numbers depending on the location?
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Tony R
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by Tony R »

Ivan wrote:
iann wrote:Lithops schwantesii ssp. schwantesii v. marthae is the same as Lithops schwantesii v. marthae...
So, what I understand from that is marthae has both C249 and C411 Cole numbers depending on the location?
Hi Ivan, Yes, you can find all the location data online from this list:
http://www.lithops.info/en/lists/lld.html
Tony Roberts
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Ivan
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by Ivan »

Tony R wrote:.. Yes, you can find all the location data online from this list:
http://www.lithops.info/en/lists/lld.html
Thanks, Tony. I have seen and used that site. It does open my eyes to not looking for just the Cole number.
When I get seeds or just want to check what the plants will look like, I like to see the flower colour as well as the pattern. I have noticed that the colour can change greatly depending on the season as well as from Canada to UK to Europe. There is a lot of variations and there is a lot of misinformation out there as well.

Here is another one I just came across. I have seeds labeled Lithops schwantesii var. urikosensis C089. Do I look for Lithops schwantesii var. urikosensis or do I look for Lithops hookeri v. marginata (red-brown Form) C089? Completely different varieties.
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D^L
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Re: Lithops nameing

Post by D^L »

C083 is an urikosensis so it might be a poorly written label. Given the name confusion I'd just grow it and enjoy.
There is debate about the value of "c" numbers these days anyway, since the plants are so many generations from the original collections and there are likely to have been a number of accidents en route. People trying to 'retrofit' coles' numbers to unnamed lithops from unknown sources on Facebook is a salutory lesson in understanding where your plants come from.
Personnally I still use them and some forms, at least, still maintain the characters of the Coles' originals, I think.
David Lambie
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