ID, please. Neoteny ?

[nirwa]

I've look for its name in many books and websites.
Still wondering what it is. Is it neoteny ?
Thanks for the reply in advance.

[IMG]http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/ii22 ... _00311.jpg[/IMG]

[Alejandro]

That looks like a T kranzianus v. minimus.

Neoteny:
http://www.cactus-art.biz/note-book/Dic ... eoteny.htm

Alex

[nirwa]

Alejandro Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That looks like a T kranzianus v. minimus.
>
> Neoteny:
> http://www.cactus-art.biz/note-book/Dictionary/Dic
> tionary_N/dictionary_neoteny.htm
>
> Alex

Indeed, that looks like a T. kranzianus var. minimus. I ever thought so.
I've compared two of them via books or Turbinicarpus Information Exchange and Cactus Art, but they just looked a little bit even quite different. It does have juvenile spines (if they are) for years, and the stems are getting longer and longer. That's why I suspect it whether a neotenic species.

Thanks for the information Alex.

T. krainzianus var. minimus in Cactus-Art

[DaveW]

Hi Nirwa,

Neoteny, for those that don't know, is the retaining of juvenile characteristics into an adult. Or basically something that never really grows up and reaches the adult stage even though it can still reproduce sexually like the Axolotl.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoteny

http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Axoltol

I must say my T. kranzianus var. minimus has never grown stems quite that long before forming more mature heads though. Whether you consider v. minimus neoteny I don't know, as it does eventually produce mature heads.

DaveW

[DaveW]

I have just brought my T. krainzianus v. minimus indoors and taken a quick and nasty picture of it under a single photoflood light since it is a bit dull in the greenhouse at the moment as it is cloudy outside. The plant is a bit shrunken as it has been dried off since September for winter and has regularly been below freezing this year.

You can see the juvenile stems and the eventual mature heads produced but the juvenile stems never got as long as yours Nirwa. It is in a 4" (10cm) square pot for scale.

[attachment 16009 minimus.jpg]

All Turbinicarpus seem to be to a greater or lesser extent dimorphic in that they retain their seedling type growth much longer than most cacti before forming adult spination. I would think describing them as dimorphic (having two forms) would probably be better than neotenous.

Minimus does retain it's juvenile form much longer than krainzianus itself. When grown from seed (BCSS seed as mine was) it originally forms long matchstick like growths and only later forms a head. Maybe there are a few different clones of minimus, some of which elongate and retain their juvenile characteristics longer than others?

See also:-

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_GJDaBn20uJQ/R6C_l ... s+(17).JPG

However from the length of the stems I think you may actually have Turbinicarpus subterraneous Nirwa, which does produce a tuberous root from which very long spindly stems form and eventually flop over under the weight of the head when it forms:-

http://www.cactus-art.biz/schede/TURBIN ... raneus.htm

DaveW

[AllanA]

Dave,Why are you trying to grow a bit of old carpet

[DaveW]

I have more of a job killing carpet in the winter than cacti Allan!

DaveW(:P)

[nirwa]

Sorry for late replying due we are having the lunar Chinese years.

Those stems look much thiner and enlongated than your T. krainzianus v. minimus and other photos on the websites. And I don't think that might be a T. subterraneous due to my another T. subterraneous doesn't really look like that. I am not sure if Those spines are juvenile though they really look like junenlie. And, I got the plants without any tuberous root presents. It's propagated from an offset.


The guy sold me that said, that's a T. krainzianus v. minimus. But I didn't really think so. It's totally mysterious and interesting cacuts, I think.

Thanks for your information, Dave.
Pitty that it's hard to mail you a plantt. If not so hard, I should share you with this interseting plant.

P.s
That lh5.ggpht.com link did not work.

[DaveW]

Hi Nirwa,

The link worked when I posted it, so they may have removed it shortly afterwards. I have just looked in Google Images and that link has now gone but this looks like the same picture posted elsewhere:-

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_GJDaBn20uJQ/Rzod9 ... s+(16).JPG

Yes I would of liked one of those they look interesting whatever they are.

Dave

[Thord]

Hi Nirwa. Your plants certainly looks like etiolated T.krainzianus v minima to my eyes.I grew some from seed some years ago and they looked exactly like that before they tired of life in a greenhouse.