Ritter's colour descriptions  Solved

For the discussion of topics related to the conservation, cultivation, propagation and exhibition of cacti & other succulents.
Forum rules
For the discussion of topics related to the conservation, cultivation, propagation and exhibition of cacti & other succulents only.

Please respect all forum members opinions and if you can't make a civil reply, don't reply!
User avatar
Paul D
BCSS Member
Posts: 826
Joined: 21 May 2009
Branch: GRAMPIAN (N.E.Scotland)
Country: UK
Role within the BCSS: Committee member
Location: Collieston, Aberdeenshire
Contact:

Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by Paul D » Tue May 04, 2021 10:55 am

In some of Friedrich Ritter's plant descriptions in Latin, he mentions colour numbers. For example in the description of Rebutia rutiliflora he says "colore 4 ad 5" (colours 4 to 5) but I can't see a reference to what colours 4 and 5 are- can anyone advise?
Paul in North-east Scotland (Grampian Branch BCSS)
National Collection Rebutia, Aylostera & Weingartia (inc. Sulcorebutia). Also growing a mixture including Ferocactus, Gymnocalycium, Lobivia, Mammillaria, Asclepiads, Lithops, Crassula, Gasteria, Haworthia.
http://www.rebutia.org.uk
User avatar
FredG
Registered Guest
Posts: 457
Joined: 18 Jun 2020
Branch: None
Country: United Kingdom

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by FredG » Tue May 04, 2021 11:13 am

Possibly the RHS Colour Chart? It appears to be an accepted standard for Botanists worldwide
Fred
Quot Homines Tot Sententiae
https://fredg.boards.net/
User avatar
iann
BCSS Member
Posts: 13777
Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Branch: MACCLESFIELD & EAST CHESHIRE
Country: UK

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by iann » Tue May 04, 2021 11:41 am

RHS "numbers" also have a letter. Even ignoring the letters, the difference between shades 5 and 6 is almost imperceptible. They are shades of yellow, although not the orange-yellow shades I'd have thought would be used for Rebutia rutiliflora. My guess is these numbers are something else.
Cheshire, UK
User avatar
Paul D
BCSS Member
Posts: 826
Joined: 21 May 2009
Branch: GRAMPIAN (N.E.Scotland)
Country: UK
Role within the BCSS: Committee member
Location: Collieston, Aberdeenshire
Contact:

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by Paul D » Tue May 04, 2021 12:44 pm

iann wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 11:41 am
RHS "numbers" also have a letter. Even ignoring the letters, the difference between shades 5 and 6 is almost imperceptible. They are shades of yellow, although not the orange-yellow shades I'd have thought would be used for Rebutia rutiliflora. My guess is these numbers are something else.
That's what I thought Ian. Wondered if there was a German equivalent?
Paul in North-east Scotland (Grampian Branch BCSS)
National Collection Rebutia, Aylostera & Weingartia (inc. Sulcorebutia). Also growing a mixture including Ferocactus, Gymnocalycium, Lobivia, Mammillaria, Asclepiads, Lithops, Crassula, Gasteria, Haworthia.
http://www.rebutia.org.uk
Detlev
BCSS Member
Posts: 31
Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Branch: None
Country: Germany
Role within the BCSS: Member

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by Detlev » Tue May 04, 2021 1:34 pm

Ritter used the colour chart of E. Biesalski: "Pflanzenfarben-Atlas", which was published in 1957. The colour chart is based on the German standard DIN 6164.
Unfortunately it is no longer available. I got my copy many years ago from an old cactus friend.
Once it was offered by Schwarz, but now it is sold out there, too: https://www.kakteen-schwarz.de/content/ ... ch&id=1032
User avatar
Paul D
BCSS Member
Posts: 826
Joined: 21 May 2009
Branch: GRAMPIAN (N.E.Scotland)
Country: UK
Role within the BCSS: Committee member
Location: Collieston, Aberdeenshire
Contact:

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions  Solved

Post by Paul D » Tue May 04, 2021 2:06 pm

Detlev wrote:
Tue May 04, 2021 1:34 pm
Ritter used the colour chart of E. Biesalski: "Pflanzenfarben-Atlas", which was published in 1957. The colour chart is based on the German standard DIN 6164.
Unfortunately it is no longer available. I got my copy many years ago from an old cactus friend.
Once it was offered by Schwarz, but now it is sold out there, too: https://www.kakteen-schwarz.de/content/ ... ch&id=1032
Aha! There is the answer. Thankyou!

I found an online version here https://dtpstudio.de/atlas/farbsysteme/ ... bs00_3.htm
Paul in North-east Scotland (Grampian Branch BCSS)
National Collection Rebutia, Aylostera & Weingartia (inc. Sulcorebutia). Also growing a mixture including Ferocactus, Gymnocalycium, Lobivia, Mammillaria, Asclepiads, Lithops, Crassula, Gasteria, Haworthia.
http://www.rebutia.org.uk
Detlev
BCSS Member
Posts: 31
Joined: 25 Jan 2009
Branch: None
Country: Germany
Role within the BCSS: Member

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by Detlev » Tue May 04, 2021 11:35 pm

I found an online version here https://dtpstudio.de/atlas/farbsysteme/ ... bs00_3.htm
Good tip, I didn't know that webpage yet.
User avatar
FredG
Registered Guest
Posts: 457
Joined: 18 Jun 2020
Branch: None
Country: United Kingdom

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by FredG » Wed May 05, 2021 7:55 am

Nice find. :grin:

So what is colore 4 ad 5 ?
Fred
Quot Homines Tot Sententiae
https://fredg.boards.net/
User avatar
anders
Registered Guest
Posts: 922
Joined: 11 Jan 2007
Branch: None
Country: Sweden
Location: Uppsala, Sweden

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by anders » Wed May 05, 2021 8:47 am

Ritter described them in Kakteen in Südamerika, vol. 1 as 4 = golden yellow, 5 = orange red.
User avatar
Paul D
BCSS Member
Posts: 826
Joined: 21 May 2009
Branch: GRAMPIAN (N.E.Scotland)
Country: UK
Role within the BCSS: Committee member
Location: Collieston, Aberdeenshire
Contact:

Re: Ritter's colour descriptions

Post by Paul D » Wed May 05, 2021 9:48 am

FredG wrote:
Wed May 05, 2021 7:55 am
Nice find. :grin:

So what is colore 4 ad 5 ?
There is also this colour wheel. Though it has been blown up from a tiny pic, and I don't think is a reliable guide to the colours! Imagine it brighter.
If anyone ever has one of these colour guide atlases to sell, please let me know.
Attachments
Pflantzenfarben wheel.jpg
Pflantzenfarben wheel.jpg (127.25 KiB) Viewed 232 times
Paul in North-east Scotland (Grampian Branch BCSS)
National Collection Rebutia, Aylostera & Weingartia (inc. Sulcorebutia). Also growing a mixture including Ferocactus, Gymnocalycium, Lobivia, Mammillaria, Asclepiads, Lithops, Crassula, Gasteria, Haworthia.
http://www.rebutia.org.uk
Post Reply